[Dogsbody]

2 1/2 years old with never a fault of any kind since new.  Always garaged.  Recently my wife reported the car would not crank when the button was pressed, it would time out then she would attempt again etc.  This has happened occassionaly when the engine is both cold and hot.  I haven't spoken to the dealer as yet (still under warranty).  Battery voltage is sitting at 12.6 overnight.  14.2 volts with engine running, 13.95 volts with everything turned on.  Any thoughts or experiences with the same  issue ?   At present this is an intermittent fault so not a lot of faith in the dealer trouble shooting it with much certainty.

[eye30]

Has Fuel filter been replaced yet at service.
If not this could be the problem.

[Dazzler]

Yes, I also suspect filter or even dodgy fuel maybe?

[Dogsbody]

OK, more info for you guys - the car is at 38,000 Kms.  I service it avery 7,500.  Fuel filter was replaced at 30,000 kms.  Fuel is always from the same source and has never been a problem, same fuel goes in my Pajero.
Remember, this problem is refusal to crank, not refusal to start.  It has done this with a hot engine after 45 minutes running so I doubt it is a battery problem as the car was stopped for only about 10 minutes.  Battery voltage this morning was 12.5 at 10 degrees C.  I am wondering if it is start interlock related, such as the brake pressure switch not always closing, or maybe the starter solenoid itself has burnt contact surfaces which cause poor current flow to the starter.  That's why I am not in too much hurry to go to the dealer,..... I'm wanting to gather more info first.  If the problem was common people here would know I'm sure.

[eye30]

Manual or auto?

[Surferdude]

Has Fuel filter been replaced yet at service.
If not this could be the problem.

How would a fuel filter stop the engine cranking over?

[Dogsbody]

Auto.  Fuel filter won't impact on cranking, as we all know, that was a reply based on (possibly) a misinterpretation of the symptoms, which I have now clarrified.

[Surferdude]

Auto.  Fuel filter won't impact on cranking, as we all know, that was a reply based on (possibly) a misinterpretation of the symptoms, which I have now clarrified.

Both your heading and first post say "cranked", so certainly misinterpreted but can't see why you needed to clarify.
In any case,  I look forward to hearing the solution when it's found.

[Dogsbody]

Yes, just to further clarrify - when the engine does crank it fires up fine.  This problem is only the fact that when the start button is depressed, (foot on the brake) there has been occassion when all the dash lights come on, glow plug timer obviously kicks in because the light goes off,...... then nothing after that.  To repeat the start procedure, foot off the brake, foot back on the brake, depress the starter button and wait.  Hopefully the sequence completes and the engine cranks.  HTH.

[Phil №❶]

I think I'd start with the Brake switch. If it's faulty, the engine won't crank.

[Dazzler]

Sorry, failure to crank, except with a flat battery is so rare, neither Lester nor I clicked until you put us straight. Thanks..

[eye30]

Has Fuel filter been replaced yet at service.
If not this could be the problem.

How would a fuel filter stop the engine cranking over?

I have heard drivers will use - not cranking- when the car will not start/fire up due to no fuel.

That was why i asked to eliminate fuel starvation.

[Dogsbody]

Ok guys, I think I may be onto it.  It played it's little trick in the garage tonight when I was paying close attention.  Brake pedal depressed, pressed the start button, waited for the glow plugs to time out, light off, then I heard the click of the starter solenoid but no cranking followed.  I reckon the contact face of the starter terminal on the  solenoid lever is burnt and not always making good contact so the starter motor is sometimes getting no juice.
I guess I need to speak to the dealer re warranty and see if they're interested in looking at it, or, in my experience, try to bullshit their way through it and fob me off.  I'm sort of thinking I ought to pull the starter off and have a  look, it's easy to get at.  By the way, all connections are good, I checked them last night.  Any  more thoughts ?

[The Gonz]

Reasonable thinking. Starter current is high so relay and solenoid contacts will suffer, and you've covered connections already. Still go the warranty path first for a chance for them to do it all for you.

[Dazzler]

Ok guys, I think I may be onto it.  It played it's little trick in the garage tonight when I was paying close attention.  Brake pedal depressed, pressed the start button, waited for the glow plugs to time out, light off, then I heard the click of the starter solenoid but no cranking followed.  I reckon the contact face of the starter terminal on the  solenoid lever is burnt and not always making good contact so the starter motor is sometimes getting no juice.
I guess I need to speak to the dealer re warranty and see if they're interested in looking at it, or, in my experience, try to bullshit their way through it and fob me off.  I'm sort of thinking I ought to pull the starter off and have a  look, it's easy to get at.  By the way, all connections are good, I checked them last night.  Any  more thoughts ?

No alternative Dealer to try if the first one fobs you off? Unfortunate that IS the case here in Tasmania. 

[Dogsbody]

More monitoring of battery voltage in the mornings, typically sitting around 12.3 volts at 8 degrees in the garage.  12.3 volts is about 60% of full charge, 12.8 being 100%.  This really needs to be verified using a hydrometer which I have, but guess what,..?.... not possible with sealed batteries.  So a full load current discharge test is the next best thing.  Norco did a test for me and confirmed the cranking amps are low but only just.  The battery is dying, it's a Delkor, 30 months old.  I replaced the battery with one from Norco, the cranking can immediately be heard to be more lively.  They gave me the old battery and told me that if the problem persists to take the car to the dealer and if it is found to be something else to return the new battery for a full refund.  I thought that was very fair of them.  I appreciate people with good business ethics.  We'll see how it goes, but I do know from experience owning a BMW bike that low voltage plays havock with electronics.

[Dazzler]

Yep, that wass great service. 30 months  is disappointing!

[Dogsbody]

Battery replaced this week, monitored the fault via feedback from the operator (wife), the problem is still there, though the original battery continues to slowly discharge in the  garage.  The car is booked in to the dealer (Motors Devonport) on Monday.  I've written them a problem description in the hope of simplifying things.  I think my money's on a burnt starter contact, we'll see,........ hopefully.

[Phil №❶]

 

[Dazzler]

[Dogsbody]

Into Motors Devonport along with a full description of the fault left in the car.  They had it there for 2 days and it wouldn't play the game (typical).  No fault codes but then there probably wouldn't be with the starting circuit.  The fault has been logged for warranty purposes though they did try the old speel on me regarding owner service etc (I sign the book and attach all my receipts for consumables, but I don't charge mysef $17.27 to dispose of the contaminated oil, and I have never left my air cleaner cover unclipped after element inspection !).
I'll monitor the situation for a while with the new battery, but the starter is very easy to remove and dismantle, it's a Valeo unit, very common in Europe.  I'm curious about the main contactor and whether it may be burnt or oxidised on the contact face.

[Dazzler]

Thanks for the update, we expected that outcome didn't we...

[Dogsbody]

Car hasn't been started for 2 days.  First attempt today, just a click at the starter solenoid.  Cranked on the second attempt but the starter sounded to labour.  The starter will be coming off for dismantle and inspect this week, time permitting.  Might post some pics to Mr Hy Aust.for interest.  Wasting my time talking to Motors, they aren't interested in being proactive.   Bloody warranties!👎

[Phil №❶]

You should try another dealer. While the car is in warranty it's Hy's problem. If you touch it then there will be no warranty covering the motor etc.

Your existing dealer should be investigated by way of official complaint.

[Dazzler]

You should try another dealer. While the car is in warranty it's Hy's problem. If you touch it then there will be no warranty covering the motor etc.

Your existing dealer should be investigated by way of official complaint.

All Hyundai Dealers in Tasmania are the same Company (Motors) the next closest is Burnie a further 50kms away or Launceston a further 100 kms away. 

[Asterix]

If you touch it then there will be no warranty covering the motor etc.

Don't agree on that. If the dealer denies to cover anything because you've made some kind of DYI they must prove that whatever they deny to cover, is caused by your DYI.

Of course it would be easier never to need that discussion....

[Dogsbody]

Got a call fom my wife this afternoon, the car had refused to crank after 10 attempts (push button start sequence).  I was flat knacker at work so I asked her to ring Motors Devonport and ask them for the procedure re disabled car.  What a fantastic response she received from this customer focussed enterprise - she was informed that because the car had not been serviced by a Hyundai dealer we had forfeited the roadside assistance component of the warranty.  So here we are,... a disabled automatic car 25 kms from the dealer and no support available unless we join RACT and go from there.  I can't begin to explain how elated I was at this but I think I will further comment in another section of this forum more suited to the purpose.
So after work I went to the car and on the second attempt it cranked just as normal and started.  Drove it home and put it in the shed, switched it off and went for a restart -  nothing except the click of the starter solenoid.  So I took a small piece of rhs about 600 mm long and proceeded to give the starter solenoid a single tap on the side with the end of the steel, a little prod you may say.  Returned to to the driver's seat and got an instant start.  Shut it down and repeated, no crank.  A little prod again, instant start.  Repeated this little ritual a few more times, it now appears that the problem is with the starter and/or solenoid.  It is a Valeo unit and appears to be fully dismantleable so it will be coming off the engine for inspection.  Meanwhile the wife will take the Paj and I'll revert to my trusty Skyline which I have owned now for 26 years and, oh yeah, the starter has never been touched on that car.  As they say, if you want it right do it yourself, well done Motors Devonport.

[CraigB]

Disappointing on the fault but at least it looks like you've found the cause, it may even be covered under the Hyundai warranty.

Concerning Hyundai's roadside assistance, it does clearly state the servicing must be done by Hyundai for the roadside assistance to be updated and maintained.

[Dogsbody]

Starter removed tonight and dismantled.  Commutator good although oxidised but not worn at all, cleaned up with 1200 grit wet n dry, washed with contact cleaner.  Brushes all good.  No problem with the pinion lever (plastic or nylon or something, probably polyamide).  Now, the solenoid, well, it appears it has been wet in the bore of the coil housing.  There was light corrosion in there but more importantly, the plastic button in the bottom of the bore that pushes the motor contactor was as stiff as hell, possibly the moisture has found its way into the main contactor for the motor.  I tested the solenoid on the bench with 12 volts.  It would not always slam hard enough to push in the contactor button at the bottom of the coil..  Washed with CRC and applied some light oil around the button.  Worked manually for a while then re-tested, totally different after the lube, really slams hard now.  Re-assembled after thoroughly cleaning out the bore and lightly oiling.  A final test on the bench and all good, very healthy solenoid travel and the switch can now clearly be heard to click at the end of the stroke.  Starter will go back in tomorrow night and all should be well..  Final report to follow.

[rustynutz]

Fingers crossed that fixes things...