i30 Owners Club
GOT PROBLEMS OR ISSUES? => DIESEL => Topic started by: ideal09 on January 06, 2019, 20:56:14
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Hello guys. I have a serius problem with my car. After 10.000km with new oil, the oil in the dipstick is about 0.7mm above the max. I guess that is something wrong with the dpf regeneration (oil mixed with diesel i guess). Has anyone run into the same problem ?
(https://i.ibb.co/bd9dH1V/20190106-131000.jpg) (https://ibb.co/j4X4VhY)
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Assuming you mean 10,000 KM that's a fair distance, over half way before the next oil change anyway.
Have you been regularly checking the oil and if so did this spike just occur?
Have you noticed any drop in coolant level?
Any white residue under engine oil cap?
Can you smell fuel on the dipstick?
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Is car on level ground?
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Is car on level ground?
Haha, yeah I didn't ask the obvious question, DOH! :)
Also was the engine cold when you checked?
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Yes, i mean 10,000 km.
The car is on level ground.
1. Yes, i often check the oil. As the kilomentres increase, the oil increases as well.
2. No, the coolant is at the same level
3. No.
4. I am not sure if i smell fuel but diesel is the only fluid that can be mixed with oil on my case.
After i changed the previous oil(castrol for diesel engines), the level was like that.
(https://i.ibb.co/5rfkswW/20180823-164021.jpg) (https://ibb.co/HtkCG3D)
With the previous oil(ENEOS PREMIUM HYPER S), after 3,000-4,000(i can't remember exactly the number) km the oil level was like that.
(https://i.ibb.co/t3MM0nQ/20180502-131851.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LvzzTBY)
and after 11,000 km was like that
(https://i.ibb.co/r3Z522D/20180802-210603.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JqzrjjD)
I went to the Hyundai dealer, and they said that 2.7 cm above the max is ok. Although huyndai i30 GD had never had issues like that such as the i20 1.1 diesel, except some correspoding cases that they solved them with a software update ( it costs 124€!).
update: yes the engine is totally cold.
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I found this this post very interesting as he talks about fuelling issues and also mentions oil level rise. Other than that I have no experience with injectors to help you with.
:link: I30 1.6 CRDi 90hp fuel pressure problem (https://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/index.php?topic=35497.msg364986#msg364986)
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Taken a bit to dig this one up, also talks about high oil, very high it appears.
:link: FORTE 2017 CRDI (https://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/index.php?topic=51055.msg467253#msg467253)
Unfortunately the discussion did not have a conclusion, @nzenigma
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I have the same problem with @Nickoss :link: Oil Rise (https://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/index.php?topic=41441.0) .
At the next oil change, i will demand the software update as a possible solution for my problem. Unfortunately, the most of mechanics in Greece are so bad, as a result you can't trust your car wherever you go for service. :undecided:
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Taken a bit to dig this one up, also talks about high oil, very high it appears.
:link: FORTE 2017 CRDI (https://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/index.php?topic=51055.msg467253#msg467253)
Unfortunately the discussion did not have a conclusion,
no conclusion, thats unusual :spitty: :rolleyes:
Mate that case was in my mind even before I scrolled down to last posts.
At 10,000km a good motor will show a minor drop in the oil level. Not a rise.
Therefore, there has to be some contaminant . Water does not mix with oil.
You are adding diesel fuel. You probably have a stuffed injector.
@ideal09 My guess is that one or more injectors are pouring more diesel into the motor that the motor can burn. Therefore it is finding its way past the piston rings to the sump.
Do you have high fuel consumption?
Does the motor sound rattly ?
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also should add this DPF nonsense because it is again referred to above.
NIKOSS: "The chief mechanic there said bla bla bla...
Anyway on my question if fuel goes to the oil after a failed regeneration,His answer was YES that happens to all diesel engines."
common sense post from-
ASTERIX: "I fail to see how the fuel should enter the oil after a failed regeneration, since Hyundai use a system where the fuel is injected directly into the DPF.
How do they explain the fuel's way back to the engine oil..?" :goodjob2:
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Fuel consumption is normal( average consumption 4.8l ).
The sound looks like a petrol engine(very quiet). During cold start engine sounds a little rattly but there is nothing significant to report.
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When i went to Hyundai dealer, the mechanic said that i30 hasn't extra injector for the dpf regeneration and this is the reason for oil rising, like the i20.
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common sense post from-
ASTERIX: "I fail to see how the fuel should enter the oil after a failed regeneration, since Hyundai use a system where the fuel is injected directly into the DPF.
How do they explain the fuel's way back to the engine oil..?" :goodjob2:
That is correct, however only for the U engine. From U2 engine onwards the DPF was mounted more or less as a part of the exhaust manifold and when regenerating, the fuel will be injected by the cylinder injector in the exhaust stroke phase. (and glow plugs will be activated to increase temperature) But it will still not explain fuel in the oil. :)
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Morning @Asterix ,
Im a bit disadvantaged in Oz because only the PD has DPF although the SUVs have had it for several years.
Essentially you are saying direct injection used on the early i30.
Assuming that ideal's level rise must be caused by fuel ingress to the sump, and looking at the dipstick level, about a litre of fuel is mixed with the oil (in 10,000km). :crazy1:
As you say, the alt. method of regeneration is to use cylinder injection, but this is done at or about the exhaust stroke, therefore the extra fuel is forced out of the cylinder.
Irrespective, The mechanic says non regened fuel goes back to the oil. As you say how?
If it filters past the rings to the sump, it is diluting the lubricant. :scared:
A rise of oil level has been reported before, but only rarely, this does not seem to be normal.
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Defective rings is a realistic reason for oil rising ?
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Defective rings is a realistic reason for oil rising ?
You havnt stated your kms, but we have members with i30s up to 500,000km. They are running ok.
Your car appears to be sound.
With defective rings, a motor would be blowing smoke out exhaust and/or crankcase pressure will rise.
Not sure if you understand 4 stroke engine principle, with respect, may be worth doing some reading.
1 The downward inlet stroke collects fuel and air
2 upward compression stroke compresses fuel and air
3 ignition stroke downward is power stroke..........
4 upward exhaust stroke clears carbon muck and CO2
2 & 3 will test quality of rings.
1 & 4. no resistance because valves are open.
Also on 4, If DPF regen operates, no resistance, extra fuel goes to exhaust.......... except in Greece where it is mysteriously piped into the sump. :twisted:
Best guess, if it is diesel mixed with oil, the regen is not syncronised or continues to deliver fuel outside the parameters outlined by Asterix.
A very small amount of this unburnt diesel seeps past the rings.The accumulation is what you see on dip stick.
Not even the French would design a motor that purposely dilutes its lub oil.
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"Not even the French would design a motor that purposely dilutes its lub oil."
:lol: :rofl:
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Ok Here I am again after long time since have been logged guys!
I Will reply(post) to this subject since this onedpf obd monitoring (https://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/index.php?topic=23357.0) is locked.
Did any of you fellows find a way to make it work with an obd scanner plug like this guy did?dpf monitoring Mazda (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thSAot5QxTs)
It would be great to know when regeneration is going to happen.I think that we should dig a bit of this issue since many of us suffering from this.
It is a great fact now that all diesel engines with dpf will be affected in oil rise because of short distances drives.
So...if now it is a well known problem, we have to face it somehow...I mean ok ...besides trade the car for a petrol one!
PLEASE HELP!
One more thing to add...
I would also like to ask,what is the real reason that there is an hour meter on the dash that counts how many hours is the engine run.
Never understand the necessity of that,Is it probably connected somehow with the dpf regeneration intervals?
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Hello fellow friends,
I have the exact same problem on the exact same car ! i30 1.4 CRDi GD (Code motor : D4FC (u2 engine)
My level is like almost 10 mm above the indicated max level :faint: .
The mechanics said to me same thing I read here; the problem origins from failing attempts to regenerate the particulate filter system.I made a diagnose and the guy said to me that it reports that the particulate filter is clogged 87 % :crazy2:
The car only has 114 K KM and I tend to believe this is a little too soon for that to happen right ? Shouldn't I get a light indication of when the regeneration happens ? Or for that matter, at that percentage, shouldn't the engine give me some signs of some sort ?! I really don't know what to do besides driving a little more throttled and keep an eye of how much the oil level rises.
The oil change was proper made.Last time the tank was filled with proper 5.3 liters and right after 1 month I checked the level and I had that insane level.I pumped out some oil to the almost max level and it had risen back. They took ~ 6.5 liters of oil at the last change.Other than diesel, it can't be something else right ? The oil I use is LM 4200 5w30.
The car works perfectly fine.No errors of any sorts.What should you think I do ? Maybe do a professional cleaning of the particulate filter ? I really don't want to cancel it.I don't to mess up with the ECU.Sorry for the long post.
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I did a bit more reading on this, unfortunately or fortunately, we haven't been cursed with DPF on the i30 until recently, so Im up front saying I have no Hands on experience here.
It seems Mazda owners have had a problem. Then "Honest John" and similar desk top warriors started to equate that issue with every car.
. question > we design engines to have free flow exhaust systems. Exhaust gas must pass through the filter. Its no use having a perfect fuel air mix going in , if the process is hampered on the way out.
If the filter is 87% clogged why do you have "The car works perfectly fine.No errors of any sorts"?
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Talking about some visual warning you can actually see on the board man.How am I suppose to to take measures if I don't get any warning indicating the particulate filter is regenerating when is close to be clogged. When I said that the filter is 87 % clogged I was getting that reading from a third party tool. No warning light and no information or any form of feedback from the cars instruments is what I meant. Maan, I really hate when we caught up in this shitty type details. I'm actually try to gain some experience from people who sort and are trying to sort out through the issue I've described.I have absolutely no interest to talk outside the subject matter.
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Talking about some visual warning you can actually see on the board man.How am I suppose to to take measures if I don't get any warning indicating the particulate filter is regenerating when is close to be clogged. When I said that the filter is 87 % clogged I was getting that reading from a third party tool. No warning light and no information or any form of feedback from the cars instruments is what I meant. Maan, I really hate when we caught up in this shitty type details. I'm actually try to gain some experience from people who sort and are trying to sort out through the issue I've described.I have absolutely no interest to talk outside the subject matter.
Gary is one of our main volunteer 'Go to" men for mechanical help on the site. He courteously explained his limited experience of the DPF situation. If you have no interest of any talk outside of the subject manner you are probably on the wrong site.
There are no warning or notification lights as far as I am aware aside from slightly increased fuel use during regeneration. There are some discussions about DPF mainly hosted by Member AlanHo but you probably wouldn't be interested in those because they mention other things as well! :undecided:
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:mrgreen: From North Auckland; thank you Dazz. :goodjob2:
Einstein probably also uttered that brilliant phrase; "Maan, I really hate when we caught up in this shitty type details". :workitout:
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I'm truly sorry guys for what I wrote upstairs.That's some really dumb things to say.I had one too many drinks :wacko: I know this is a stupid excuse but I really had a bad day yesterday at work.I apologies for sounding dismissive and not interested. I read some really useful information from the members posts and hope it'll help me fix or at least diagnose correctly my issue with my i30.
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I'm truly sorry guys for what I wrote upstairs.That's some really dumb things to say.I had one too many drinks :wacko: I know this is a stupid excuse but I really had a bad day yesterday at work.I apologies for sounding dismissive and not interested. I read some really useful information from the members posts and hope it'll help me fix or at least diagnose correctly my issue with my i30.
Apology accepted. It's always hard to diagnose by remote control. For us Aussies the DPF is still a bit of a mystery, we have to rely on our European members to get the relevant info most of the time.
We do have a bit of a bad habit of getting sidetracked (I'm one of the worst - can't let accurate information get in the way of a good joke) :snigger:
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:ta: :whsaid:
I will do a bit more digging when back from my holiday. All the discussion here and in other areas of the web do not give any evidence based advice on exactly how fuel does not leave the motor, and presumably trickles down into the sump.
Cheers Gary
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oil is rising almost certainly because of the failed DPF regeneration.
Hyundai mentions in the car manual that the DPF filter needs change at 200000 kilometers.
you can spot the time when your car goes on regeneration if you notice several main events occurring during regeneration.
it's always when you have driven your car for a few kilometers and the coolant temperature is at 90C.
you will also notice the car has significantly less power and you will get lots of turbo lag.
Wastegate stops making hissing sounds when off throttle.
lastly the most obvious is by looking the instant consumption meter you will see that even when you are in-gear and off throttle fuel consumption does not drop to 0l/100 km.
you have to drive at least once a month outside of the city to give time for regeneration to be completed.i have noticed at my car it takes about 15-20 minutes or about 25-30 kilometers to regenerate,and i had no oil rising so far.
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I notice that much of this discussion has originated in Greece, perhaps you guys do less highway travel than other members? :undecided: Or maybe you are more observant. :mrgreen:
The oil level problem was discussed in 2016. The member's experience was really valuable but we seem to miss it and keep reading the chatter.
So here it is again!!!!!!!
:link: Oil Rise (https://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/index.php?topic=41441.0)
If you also read the attached link to Mazda CX5, it would seem that they have a design fault.
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Could be the EGR is recirculating that raw fuel too.
If that amount is being eaten, it will get by the rings ruining any carbon seal on the way and of course, the lube quality of the oil is degraded.
It really does sound like an appalling bit of engineering.
What can't ANY designers get this right.
Saw a new HiLux at the lights blowing so much white smoke the whole street disappeared.
The choking smell was raw unburnt diesel.
When the lights changed to green, away he puffed like a steam train.
How hard can it be to programme NOT to burn when a car is stationary ????
Oh what a feeling.......
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Could be the EGR is recirculating that raw fuel too.
If that amount is being eaten, it will get by the rings ruining any carbon seal on the way and of course, the lube quality of the oil is degraded.
It really does sound like an appalling bit of engineering.
What can't ANY designers get this right.
Saw a new HiLux at the lights blowing so much white smoke the whole street disappeared.
The choking smell was raw unburnt diesel.
When the lights changed to green, away he puffed like a steam train.
How hard can it be to programme NOT to burn when a car is stationary ????
Oh what a feeling.......
The New lux's have a manual burn button now. Lots of previous years are being updated.
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The New lux's have a manual burn button now. Lots of previous years are being updated.
Wow! Im getting one :twisted:
Cut in front of slow driver on the idiot brake, listen to pathetic honking, HIT BUTTON. .. Ah heaven! :happydance:
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The New lux's have a manual burn button now. Lots of previous years are being updated.
Wow! Im getting one :twisted:
Cut in front of slow driver on the idiot brake, listen to pathetic honking, HIT BUTTON. .. Ah heaven! :happydance:
:snigger: :victory:
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Hey Asterix, I looked at your DPF photo and are you sure that's a diesel fuel inject hose?
It looks too crappy, just has a spring hose clamp on the rubber hose and generally looks way too large/unsophisticated.
To me to looks like a pressure sensor hose running back to a cooler spot to mount the sensor.
It would tell the system if the DPF is blocked due to higher than normal back pressure.
????
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Mate everything under a Euro or Scando car looks crappy. Due to their winter conditions.
Personally, it looks like an O2 sensor with a dodgy rubber hose.
Asterix knows more about the DPF than we do so it is what it is.
Possibly Hyundai produced the early FD, then got caught by legislation and retro fitted the filter before the customer got it.
Thats theory #8 :cool:
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The New lux's have a manual burn button now. Lots of previous years are being updated.
Wow! Im getting one :twisted:
Cut in front of slow driver on the idiot brake, listen to pathetic honking, HIT BUTTON. .. Ah heaven! :happydance:
@nzenigma
:rofl: :rofl: :victory:
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Hi all,
I'm talked to several mechanics and as @rfactor they told me the same thing. Could be from failed regeneration attempts. One of them told me that he could pinpoint the source of the oil rise problem only after replacing the differential pressure sensor. He tested the car and told me that the temperature rises to quick.The ECU indicated that it had a lot of failed regeneration attempts. So I've bought one from Hyundai Mobis (through a eBay seller) straight from Korea. You guys think I should get it replaced ? I'm a little concerned I could break something . After my recent oil change I only purred 4.7 liters instead of 5.3 as indicating by the book. The oil still resides at the maximum indication on the dip stick. After 3000 Kms the level hasn't changed. If I would to change the sensor, GDS states that I should instruct the ECU that I've changed it. What are your thoughts of this ? Should I go for it ? I'm kind of worried that at the last oil change the viscosity was kind of abnormal. Kind of watery like. Sorry for my not so good english . Don't speak it natively.