[tw2005]

any possibility there's poorly contacting fuses or relays in the main engine bay fuse box?

keep that battery charged up, I suspect if the volts get to about 10-11V the ECU won't like it, especially whilst cranking.

[cruiserfied]

Thanks again gentlemen.

It may open up a few more questions for me.

What does the crank shaft sensor do?
If it fails (in sensing the crank shaft motion), will still prevent the engine from starting?

Will "DTC" report its failure?

Where is the crank shaft sensor, under the bonnet?
Is it equally awkward to get to, check and replace compare with the immobiliser?

Sorry for so many questions.

Crank sensor basic explanation is that it tells the computer the position of the piston so it can inject fuel at the right time. It also measures engine speed which shows on tacho.

A crank sensor SHOULD log a DTC but ive been caught before.

Location is on the side of the engine block. Not super easy to get to.

[pcmc]

Thanks again, cruiserfied,

What does DTC stand for by the way?

I recall when the car was returned to me by the dealer the last time,
I drove home that night and then drove to work on the next morning.
I dont recall getting any symptom of miss firing of the piston over that 22 miles journey.
 
Then on the evening, the car could not start right away.

If the crank shaft sensor is controlling the piston firing, then it seems to function okay.

Maybe my naive assumption.

I suppose ideally is to disarm the immobiliser altogether,
it can then verify if the crank shaft sensor still operates okay....

[nzenigma]

you can see that in normal starting, the rev counter will move a bit
and in a faulty starting, the immobilizer symbol stay on until the engine finely starts.

Thanks yodm, your clip shows the small rev blip before start up that I have also described earlier to cruiserfied.
Peter's, video also shows this rev blip, but in his case the immobiliser symbol remains illuminated, unlike yours ( and mine). We must assume it is locked...until we are (hopefully) proven wrong.
Why we still get that initial signal from the crank, I cannot explain at this stage.

A few months ago, I had the same situation/evidence on a new Ford Ranger. Two mechanics had given it up as immobiliser locked.
By chance , I found that moving the key sideways in the ignition before turning the key to start, got a result; engine started and ran perfectly. I was out in the bush so just I squirted some WD40 down the keylock barrel and it never failed from thereon. Over the next few weeks, I could not find out what the original problem had been. I assume the antennae coil was the culprit.....BUT

[nzenigma]

Thanks again, cruiserfied,

What does DTC stand for by the way?

I recall when the car was returned to me by the dealer the last time,
I drove home that night and then drove to work on the next morning.
I dont recall getting any symptom of miss firing of the piston over that 22 miles journey.
 
Then on the evening, the car could not start right away.

If the crank shaft sensor is controlling the piston firing, then it seems to function okay.

Maybe my naive assumption.

I suppose ideally is to disarm the immobiliser altogether,
it can then verify if the crank shaft sensor still operates okay....

The DTC= Diagnostic Trouble Code ;  a scan tool reads the codes to reveal the engine faults.

Car Terminology: Discussing DTC (Diagnostic Trouble Code) and DTC Readers | Auto Mechanic | Auto Mechanic Repair and Maintenance Tips

It would be far simpler to change the crank sensor.

[pcmc]

Thanks for the tip, nzenigma,

Last night, I have called up the recovery service to take the car back from the company car park to the Hyundai dealer in Oxford.

To be honest, I am not sure how much luck would I get from them this time,
given they have already tried 3 times.

I did request them to rectify the fault fully, on the understanding that a 6 hours labour bill (with parts on top) is on the way...

The car is dead basically with the immobilier in dead lock...

[cruiserfied]

If they know what they are doing they can deactivate the immobiliser with the scan tool and attempt to start. This will instantly prove immobiliser if it starts or other if not.
Don't get too excited though, it only allows 2 starts and you need to know the security PIN and scan tool to do it.

[pcmc]

Thanks for this superb info, cruiserfied,

Are you also implying that not all Hyundai dealer techs have this scan tool and the security pin to deactivate the immobiliser on a Hyundai?

I wonder what is holding them up to do this scan, as oppose to warning me of spending 3 hours of labour to open up the "front" to investigate?   

[cruiserfied]

Dealer will have the scantool and should know how to deactivate. They wouldn't have done it before because it only applies under a no start situation and yours was starting when they looked at it.
Give them a bit of time and trust.

[pcmc]

After 3 unsuccessful attempts and the cost of £320,
I would not like to see more  .

May I ask how much time this scan tool would generally take to set up and deactivate the immobiliser?

[cruiserfied]

Thsts fair enough and im not made of money either.
If i read correctly.
First and second visit the fault didn't occur. Very hard to chase a concern that isn't presenting itself.
They replaced the exhaust piece and it didn't fix the start issue but it definately would have caused grief to the engine if left as it was.
Third time they carried out a repair and as far as they knew it had fixed it. No need to look further and take more of your money for pointless labour time.
Pain in the arse and expensive, but at least it aint a VW 😆

[pcmc]

Probably no need to go back to what have or have done.
I just wish not to be disappointed again.

Can I ask again how much time this scan tool would generally take to set up and deactivate the immobiliser?

[nzenigma]

Friday night! Tim's probably having a few well earned North Queensland beers.
Scan tool is a simple plug in procedure. With the PIN, 5 minutes.
 What it reveals.....???? minutes/hours/weeks
Good Luck

[yodm]

what is the difference between the port in the cabin and the diagnostic port in the engine bay?

[tw2005]

Old sonata crank sensor fault I found interesting.

[nzenigma]

After 3 unsuccessful attempts and the cost of £320,
I would not like to see more  .

May I ask how much time this scan tool would generally take to set up and deactivate the immobiliser?

Hi, pcmc,
  Another member has had a similar problem with his immobiliser. It may be worth investigating your own vehicle given that you are both in the grips of winter.
In short,  corrosion was probably on a door-open switch circuit . It had too much resistance to operate the ceiling light, but enough conductivity to wrongly indicate that a door was open.

Starting problems - Immobiliser stifles engine start-up

@cruiserfied @pcmc

[pcmc]

Hello all,

It has been a good three weeks since my i30 been towed to the local Hyundai dealer for repair on the car start problem.

Yesterday, I received a call from them  that they have now found the fault, for that they have replaced the crank shaft position sensor to rectify the fault.

I have tried the car last night, and again this morning.

The car does start, but I have feeling that it starts after hearing a few (3?)  cranks on the ignition.
If I then turn off the engine, leave the key in, start again, then it starts much quicker, almost instantly.

I then take the key out, start the car, it does start after hearing 3 cranks again.

Being tainted by a non-starting car, I am not sure if the car is fully repaired.

Can any expert kindly comment on this?



The car starts about 25th second.

[Shambles]

Looks and sounds pretty decent to me.

[pcmc]

Ok, thanks very much Shambles for your comment.

[nzenigma]

Looks and sounds pretty decent to me.

Me too. Good Luck

[pcmc]

Okay, thanks too to  nzenigma.

It is quite comforting to hear these positive comments.

Peter