Author Topic: EGR valve  (Read 46041 times)

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #30 : November 10, 2011, 06:06:53 »
post the pics, ill give it a go and see if the ultraguage shows any differences
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #31 : November 10, 2011, 07:35:33 »
i been told by many people that it dont harm the engine. even the mechanic at my local hyundai dealer said block it off, it helps the engine breath clean air instead of its own S**t, plus helps turbo spoll up quick which is less turbo lag. the egr on i30 is electronic and runs at the back of engine from turbo. FRom my experiance the car runs smoother , alot quieter , and alot more torque and power. people have different opinions regarding egr valve. But when my local hyundai mechanic says block it , that said it all for me. i used coke can as tempory shim just to see if it caused any warning lights. and it hasn't... if you do block your egr valve block from exhaust side not the valve itself, and leave valve connected to loom. then it wont bring up any faults cos ECU thinks its still doing its job.

Thanks guys i will keep you posted if i get any fault lights come up

All this is true, and EGR is as far as i know completely useless and pointless device just like DPF! Only there to cause problems and in the end for unlucky owners nice financial problem. Only "real" use to insignificantly save ecology and to look like car industry cares LOL LOL LOL and LOL!

One question, EGR valve prevents creation of NOX gasses by "limiting" complete combustion by transfering 5-15% of exhaust gasses into intake.
So, when you remove it you have cleaner intake, better combustion, more hp and better economy, but ALSO higher exhaust temps in my opinion.
Like i said, EGR prevents complete combustion because thats when NOX gasses are created...you remove EGR, complete combustion -> temps go up...will this affect engine in any way?
Also some people report knocking which is not good....

Much appreciated if you could ask this your hyundai mechanic.
THX!

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #32 : November 10, 2011, 15:22:40 »
BTW does the petrol engine have EGR? My other car doesn't, because of fuel injection. EGR's were introduced to combat NOx production caused by "Lean burn" carburettor technology, but I think fuel injection is not lean burn so it shouldn't be required, only in Diesel engines.
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #33 : November 11, 2011, 06:02:38 »
"knocking" in a direct injected diesel?

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #34 : November 11, 2011, 15:36:56 »
"knocking" in a direct injected diesel?

I said people reported it, im not into mechanics that much to know is it true or not.
I checked with my dealer and he said there's no down side to this so i'll block it next week.

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #35 : November 12, 2011, 07:52:02 »
EGR blocking is common on many makes, I believe Hy use a different term for similar technology but I DONT see any Threads about poor "EGR" performance / failure on this site.

I had a new EGR on my last car, a Fiat Grande Punto, 1.9 MJet, at around 50,000 miles as it became completely choked / blocked & the solenoid operation plunger had seized with soot. Many Fiat owners ask about & discuss the advantages / draw-backs of blocking off the EGR. Bottom line is that there is no performance or economy benefits over a fully operational EGR, however, if there were issues related to a partly ineffective EGR then blocking i off MAY seem to improve things. In reality, he EGR provides a cooling effect on the incoming charge for combustion as well as reducing the NoX content of a modern diesel, probably the same for a petrol engine with an EGR... Some schools of thoughts suggest blocking the EGR may be detrimental to Turbo life....

If i understand it correctly how can that be?
I think its quite the opposite, EGR was the one who let very hot and dirty gasses into turbine and that was what shortened the life span.
Now turbo gets nice clean cold air from intake and it is cut off from exhaust.
Am i wrong?

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #36 : November 12, 2011, 21:41:47 »
I don't have any technical drawings to show the actual path of EGR gasses but I think that the stress on the turbine comes from the hot side.

The turbine has 2 sets of vanes on a common shaft. The compressor side takes incoming air and forcefully compresses the cool air driven by the energy in the shaft from the exhaust gasses.

There is no argument that the high compression of diesel combustion causes the creation of NOx gasses. So, unfortunately EGR is required to COOL THE COMBUSTION IN THE CYLINDER which in turn, reduces NOx gasses AND provides COOLER EXHAUST GASSES.

If EGR is blocked off, exhaust gasses will be very high and these gasses pass through and drive the turbine. This extra heat could stress the turbo over time and cause failure, so you see blocking EGR increases exhaust gas temperature.

Make no mistake, I hate the EGR concept too.  :neutral:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #37 : November 13, 2011, 04:53:35 »
True.

+ when you floor it EGR is closed, so i guess again there is no increase in temperature only in that condition.

Only real problem is normal driving and sustaining speed (which is like 90% of the time for me), lets say highway constant 110kph. Then egr should be open to lower temp and now is not.

So looks like only real question remains, how big is that temperature raise?

For example: normal driving with EGR is 600 celzius, and without is 700 celzius, and maximum is 800, then yes, somewhat bigger stress on turbine but in the end not that significant.

If normal driving with egr  is 600 celzius, and without 750 celzius, and maximum is 700, then yes, that is big issue for sure.

I'll see with my dude in hyundai if we can go for a ride and he connects diagnostic laptop to read temperatures after closure.

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #38 : November 13, 2011, 05:02:33 »
That would be a very good & informative test. I'd love to close mine off too, but not on the strength of other people's opinions, something more scientific is required.
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #39 : November 13, 2011, 05:12:29 »
That would be a very good & informative test. I'd love to close mine off too, but not on the strength of other people's opinions, something more scientific is required.

I saw this topic and asked my dude in Hyundai (which has already done all that modification on my car flawlessly) and his answer was there's absolutely no reason not to block it, its only for ecology.
And i asked one dude more from another forum (insane amount of knowledge he has), this dude is special because "he gets epileptic seizure" every time any1 does a modification on a car. And even he said he already has his EGR blocked.
So for me these are 2 opinions that count even tho real data is "missing".

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #40 : November 13, 2011, 05:23:56 »
So, are you going to do the test you previously mentioned or not.

Ecology is still an issue, you are contributing to dirty brown NOx when you drive which you breathe too.
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #41 : November 13, 2011, 05:48:19 »
Was answering on your comment about other people opinion, not on the part you need proof etc.
I will do my best to do the test (i cant force hyudnai dealer to go with me to measure, its purely his will).
I dont care about ecology so thats out of the way for me.

Re: EGR valve
« Reply #42 : November 16, 2011, 03:14:22 »
 :goodjob: Good to see some of you guys are looking into the EGR block, I have now done 40 000kms with EGR blocked of in my CRDI 4WD, with no side effects, besides cleaner oil & lower engine & intake temps, according to my scan gauge. Do anybody have pictures of where to block EGR on i30, had a quick look, can't seem to locate EGR cooler.
Cheers Bloodnut

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #43 : November 16, 2011, 06:32:55 »
I see quite a few fans of this concept on the site.. I do wonder though, if there are no downsides, why it is not like that my default  :confused:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #44 : November 24, 2011, 15:27:22 »
Post a DIY.... I would block mine! :)

Re: EGR valve
« Reply #45 : November 27, 2011, 05:28:20 »
Have found the egr pipe, cooler & valve, just haven't had time to block it , should get to it over chrissie break.
Cheers Bloodnut :goodjob2:

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #46 : November 27, 2011, 06:25:19 »
I see quite a few fans of this concept on the site.. I do wonder though, if there are no downsides, why it is not like that my default  :confused:
its an emissions law dazz.  :idea:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #47 : November 27, 2011, 16:00:52 »
Guess I'm just cautious about warranty issues.. :confused:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #48 : November 29, 2011, 03:31:58 »
On my other crdi ute, the egr block plate, can be remove by undoing 2 10 mm nuts, the plate is slotted where the studs are, can be removed for warranty issues in 2 mins flat, including fetching the spanner.
Cheers Bloodnut

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #49 : November 29, 2011, 14:40:36 »
Hi
I know that VW had problems with EGR on their TDI engines, they created a new plate with a lot smaller hole, that worked. No problems regarding the emission control every 2. year either.

BR
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #50 : November 29, 2011, 16:20:12 »
Just thought I'd mention, in the 70's I blocked my EGR in a Subaru flat four engine. 1400k's later, 2 collapsed exhaust valves. Had to remove & replace them myself.

So it's not only the turbo, there are 8 exhaust valves in the diesel & you can imagine what Hyundai will charge to do that job.

I still recommend, don't do it.  :fum:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #51 : November 30, 2011, 15:00:11 »
Yesterday my EGR was blocked. From the 200km i made till now i can only say "damn why i didnt do it long time ago!".

So obviously i am thrilled about positive experience i have, regarding problems you mentioned i will hope that they are random or certain model relevant.
If not, well, i'll have to deal with it some day in the future.

I still owe a measurement we couldnt do yesterday because its rush hour in the service coz of hyundai winter action car checkup  for  0.20 $.

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #52 : December 01, 2011, 16:07:02 »
Hi Xamaxy

What exactly did you gain by blocking the EGR..?
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #53 : December 02, 2011, 11:38:05 »
Hi Xamaxy

What exactly did you gain by blocking the EGR..?

No more turbo lag, car now accelerates immediately from 1700rpm above. Insanely good feeling especially compared to before. (also this can be so obvious because of my other upgrades that was dampened by egr or something like that)

Throttle/car response in shifting between 1st and 2nd gear improved.

I think its even a bit quieter, perhaps placebo...

Estimated KM on BC went from 790km to 855km after only 20km with blocked EGR, which can perhaps suggest a slight improvement in economy.

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #54 : December 03, 2011, 01:34:03 »
how did you do it?
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #55 : December 03, 2011, 07:26:03 »
Brass plate sealing in front of EGR (if i translated it correctly). So that the hot gasses cant eventually heat their way through.

I guess something like this i found on internet.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=70823&d=1168629163

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #56 : December 04, 2011, 06:03:19 »
Here's some condensed info regarding turbo failure from blocked / dirty EGR valve. Apparently, this really happened.

1. Engine temps increase.
2. Turbo seals fail.
3. Engine oil passes through broken seals into vacuum created by turbo inlet.
4. Engine runs on oil instead of diesel. No throttle control, goes to red line until oil is consumed or turbo / engine destruction. In the end engine seizes.
5. Ign key has no effect. If auto, car would go berserk.

How do you deal with this, with possibly no warning.

This is potentially dangerous.  :disapp:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #57 : December 04, 2011, 06:31:53 »
Hi,

i am interested in this so can you please post a link to guy that this happened to?

"1. Engine temps increase"
I believe that diesel engine has higher exhaust temps @4000rpms then @2000rpms, right?
EGR by definition works only on normal driving, when you floor it it is shut off, right?
How can normal driving temp increase be even remotely compared to temps @4000rpm to make that kind of damage?

Also, i can redo your list that fits also :mrgreen::

1. Dude got car tuned (chip, egr, intake etc), raced it cold, turned it off without turbo cooling off, often high reving, playing Schumacher...
2. Turbo seals fail.
3. Engine oil passes through broken seals into vacuum created by turbo inlet.
4. Engine runs on oil instead of diesel. No throttle control, goes to red line until oil is consumed or turbo / engine destruction. In the end engine seizes.
5. Ign key has no effect. If auto, car would go berserk.

PS
Wiki copy/paste "EGR systems can also add abrasive contaminants and increase engine oil acidity, which in turn can reduce engine longevity."
Shall we name all the parts that can be destroyed from this and factory made it this way? :scared:

 :goodjob:

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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #58 : December 04, 2011, 06:40:02 »
I hate the idea of EGR valves as much as you, I agree with you entirely, we need a better alternative.

http://www.fiatforum.com/multipla/258910-egr-blanking.html  :undecided:
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Re: EGR valve
« Reply #59 : December 04, 2011, 07:25:14 »
I've read all 3 pages and it is exactly the same like what we have here hehe :mrgreen:

You seem to favor 'widemouthfrog' comments, while i favor 'momoe' comments :mrgreen:

EGR looks like to be completely the same as chip-tuning subject. Many pros and cons but without definitive data :happydance:
So, how did anyone chose to do it?

For me, it all comes down to who did recommend this.
For example, i first saw about EGR blocking right here in this topic. Then i immediately contacted 2 persons. One is dude with extreme car knowledge that hates any tuning to the car (buy stronger car if you want more power) and his answer was "i did egr block on all my 4 cars right away" . Second dude was my Official Hyundai Service guy who says " yep, its ecology crap thingy, 10min job to block it and no harm done".
I was like WOW, what about all the problems i read on internet like higher temps, eco tests etc and they both laughed.

That was good enough for me to get it.  :D

PS
Check engine light and p0401 error is quite easily solved by drilling small hole in the blocking plate and in that way ECU detects some gasses and doesnt bitch about it :rofl:


 


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